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The September 2008 Newsletter contained an essay by Philip Sudworth on Point 8 which he entitled “Faith into Action”. Part of what he wrote is reproduced below with permission.
* How do you respond to his assessment? Is he right in commenting,”PCN will come of age when its focus moves from what we believe to what we are going to do about it,” or should PCN remain fundamentally as a discussion forum?
* Pavel
* *

“Faith into Action
* “I am quite sure that the discussion groups serve a very useful purpose in supporting forward thinking Christians, who often feel isolated within traditional churches, and in introducing them to writers, teachers and scholars who will help them to take their thinking further.  I know from personal experience that, after struggling with faith for years amongst those who have simple, unquestioning, traditional beliefs, it is very comforting to realize that one is not alone and that there are many others on the same quest with whom one can be open about doubts and dreams.
* “Yet, if our approach to God is truly to be through the life and teachings of Jesus, we must realize that faith is far more about challenge and commitment than feeling comfortable.  While coming to a personal position on theological points is important in establishing our individual integrity, it is only when this is translated into action on behalf of others that it begins to have real value.  To paraphrase James 2:17: “It doesn’t matter how modern your faith is. Unless it produces good deeds, it is dead and useless.”

*
“Of course, PCN members will all be active in a wide variety of charity work as part of their discipleship, but how many of them are doing this in their role as a PCN member or feel that they are “equipped” or even supported by PCN, practically or spiritually, in the work they are called to carry out? 
* “The reason I have remained within my local evangelical Methodist church, despite being told frequently that I am not a Christian, is because it provides a societal framework through which I have been able to respond much more effectively to local community needs than I ever could as a lone searcher after truth.  PCN may keep me spiritually sane, but it is the traditional church that supports me in expressing my faith practically, even as it reiterates that good deeds will avail me nothing without the ‘right’ beliefs.
* “PCN will come of age when its focus moves from what we believe to what we are going to do about it.  This would probably involve a change in its mission statement from “to promote and support open and contemporary Christian understanding” to something like “to provide encouragement, support and training for open and contemporary Christian discipleship.”  Then its conferences and courses will spend far less time in differentiating itself from conventional Christianity and far more on practical issues.  How do we communicate our modern thinking to the great majority who don’t read theology without appearing to debunk Christianity totally?  What words of comfort do we give to the dying and the bereaved, if we don’t believe in a traditional Heaven?  What are we actually going to do to carry out the mission Jesus declared - struggling for justice for the oppressed, ministering to the broken-hearted, supporting and encouraging the poor and giving those leading restricted lives new horizons?  How do we bring hope to a European continent that is increasingly rapidly losing faith?
* “From my experience churches don’t become communities because the people share the same beliefs or participate in worship together but when its members care for each other.  The best way of engendering the spirit of community is to work together on some project that is focused outside the church.  We need to look at how we make our local PCN groups much more than talking shops.
* “In PCN we have to be more passionate about people than points of theology, we need to see ourselves as doers rather than doubters, and we must express our liberalism through the way we love and live.  It is then that we become true followers of Jesus and can justifiably begin the Eight Points with - ‘We are Christians.’”
* Philip Sudworth

I can see why Philip Sudworth remains in his church and values the community it provides and engenders. I also find it hard to contemplate a response to the life of Jesus that doesn’t involve an active response to the world. But whether or not that means PCN groups should work together on practical projects, I am not sure at the moment. But then, I belong to a ‘Living the Questions’ group which is part of a local church which encourages and supports activism in the local community and in the politics of the wider world. I think in our situation there is a natural flow between the talk and what it produces in our lives and shared lives. I suppose PCN could resource us with links and information, a bit like some of the evanglical networks, but it wouldn’t be the only player in the field, with things like Ekklesia, CAP, Christian Aid, Oxfam, Amnesty, etc also resourcing real engagement, alongside all the agents in the local scene.

I am just thinking ‘out loud’ really. But Philip Sudworth is right, I think, that it can be more difficult to engage without a societal framework of some kind. It would be interesting to hear of other situations, where perhaps people feel more peripheral to their church or community, and what people have found ‘out there’ in terms of societal frameworks that enable community and engagement with the world, and whether they feel PCN groups can choose to perform that function or have a motivational role, or have value as a space aside from activism, an alternative to busy-ness, which matters too in this world, I believe.

It is a long time since this thread was activated and discussion started and appeared to have finished. However, Philip’s comments remain true and challenging. For me, liberal Christians seem to know what they don’t believe but often are reluctant to share what they do believe [all kinds of reasons for that - another thread starting, perhaps?] but progressive Christians [at least in my experience] are keen to develop what we do believe. But unless what we say about the Jesus Way is backed up by living out our words in action then we are no more than a talking shop. As Karen Armstrong has recently reminded us, ‘belief’ originally was about the way one lived not about intellectual consent to a series of ideas, creeds or doctrines. But whether or not the purpose of PCN-Britain is to be action-based is debatable. Perhaps the purpose of PCN is to support progressive Christians within their local communities so that they know that it is OK to think differently - but the actions come as a result of working alongside liberals, traditionalists, evangelicals, Muslims, Jews, Hindus, etc etc for the common good.

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Welcome! Enjoy the site and add your own thoughts!

I have really enjoyed reading this thread and I think Phillip has come up with some very challenging statements. I would love to see the Christian faith universally become a faith of action and love as Jesus commanded that adresses the needs and demands of today. As progressive Christians or whatever label we choose or do not choose I think we should be spear heads in many ways. I admire the Quakers for this. They are more about the experiencial and practical than about belief i.e. they have offices in the UN. Actually in the mainstream Church I don’t think there is a lack of passion for doing good but I think there is a worry about 1. how do be effective in doing good 2. some churches are paralysed by their sense that they are not “saving” enough people. I think the sermon on the mount is THE sermon to follow in relation to this. Jesus giving a commandment and actually telling people how to actually go about it. It was challenging but also empowering. Steve Chalke gives the example of turning the other cheek. (I may have the exact descrition a but mixed up)Chalke noted that to strike someone with the back of your hand, in Roman values, was demeaning and essentially calling you a slave. To turn the other cheek was to invite the oppressor to strike you properly which would be recognition of equal status.

We in our faith need to be challenged, we need to challenge but we also need to empower and be empowered. I give no opinion on the PCN as yet because I am not yet a member.

Pavel - 14 November 2008 08:56 PM

The September 2008 Newsletter contained an essay by Philip Sudworth on Point 8 which he entitled “Faith into Action”. Part of what he wrote is reproduced below with permission.
* How do you respond to his assessment? Is he right in commenting,”PCN will come of age when its focus moves from what we believe to what we are going to do about it,” or should PCN remain fundamentally as a discussion forum?
* Pavel
* *

“Faith into Action
* “I am quite sure that the discussion groups serve a very useful purpose in supporting forward thinking Christians, who often feel isolated within traditional churches, and in introducing them to writers, teachers and scholars who will help them to take their thinking further.  I know from personal experience that, after struggling with faith for years amongst those who have simple, unquestioning, traditional beliefs, it is very comforting to realize that one is not alone and that there are many others on the same quest with whom one can be open about doubts and dreams.
* “Yet, if our approach to God is truly to be through the life and teachings of Jesus, we must realize that faith is far more about challenge and commitment than feeling comfortable.  While coming to a personal position on theological points is important in establishing our individual integrity, it is only when this is translated into action on behalf of others that it begins to have real value.  To paraphrase James 2:17: “It doesn’t matter how modern your faith is. Unless it produces good deeds, it is dead and useless.”

*
“Of course, PCN members will all be active in a wide variety of charity work as part of their discipleship, but how many of them are doing this in their role as a PCN member or feel that they are “equipped” or even supported by PCN, practically or spiritually, in the work they are called to carry out? 
* “The reason I have remained within my local evangelical Methodist church, despite being told frequently that I am not a Christian, is because it provides a societal framework through which I have been able to respond much more effectively to local community needs than I ever could as a lone searcher after truth.  PCN may keep me spiritually sane, but it is the traditional church that supports me in expressing my faith practically, even as it reiterates that good deeds will avail me nothing without the ‘right’ beliefs.
* “PCN will come of age when its focus moves from what we believe to what we are going to do about it.  This would probably involve a change in its mission statement from “to promote and support open and contemporary Christian understanding” to something like “to provide encouragement, support and training for open and contemporary Christian discipleship.”  Then its conferences and courses will spend far less time in differentiating itself from conventional Christianity and far more on practical issues.  How do we communicate our modern thinking to the great majority who don’t read theology without appearing to debunk Christianity totally?  What words of comfort do we give to the dying and the bereaved, if we don’t believe in a traditional Heaven?  What are we actually going to do to carry out the mission Jesus declared - struggling for justice for the oppressed, ministering to the broken-hearted, supporting and encouraging the poor and giving those leading restricted lives new horizons?  How do we bring hope to a European continent that is increasingly rapidly losing faith?
* “From my experience churches don’t become communities because the people share the same beliefs or participate in worship together but when its members care for each other.  The best way of engendering the spirit of community is to work together on some project that is focused outside the church.  We need to look at how we make our local PCN groups much more than talking shops.
* “In PCN we have to be more passionate about people than points of theology, we need to see ourselves as doers rather than doubters, and we must express our liberalism through the way we love and live.  It is then that we become true followers of Jesus and can justifiably begin the Eight Points with - ‘We are Christians.’”
* Philip Sudworth

Welcome! Enjoy the site and add your own thoughts!

In response to what Matt Hicks says in this thread I am inclined to agree with his statement,

Actually in the mainstream Church I don’t think there is a lack of passion for doing good but I think there is a worry about 1/ how to be effective in doing good. 2/ Some churches are paralysed by their sense that they are not “saving” enough people.

In particular with regards to the second clause, this is the whole reason for existence of many churches, without the “saving” activity many churches have no reason to exist. I used to think that too.

From my own perspective because, I’m not a church attender, let alone a member, I cannot do much more than simply read and debate the issues. I’m not like Philip Sudworth who says

“The reason I have remained within my local evangelical Methodist church, despite being told frequently that I am not a Christian, is because it provides a societal framework through which I have been able to respond much more effectively to local community needs than I ever could as a lone searcher after truth.  PCN may keep me spiritually sane, but it is the traditional church that supports me in expressing my faith practically, even as it reiterates that good deeds will avail me nothing without the ‘right’ beliefs.”

Perhaps I’m not as tough as Philip, in so much as I tend to withdraw from difficult circumstances rather than voice my own opinion in the face of opposition. I made a quick exist from the last church service I attended after the sermon on “the reality of hell”.

Philip also said,

“From my experience churches don’t become communities because the people share the same beliefs or participate in worship together but when its members care for each other.  The best way of engendering the spirit of community is to work together on some project that is focused outside the church.  We need to look at how we make our local PCN groups much more than talking shops.

He’s absolutely correct that it is the care of one another that makes community and that is what I miss the most after leaving my last church. I’m only aware of one other progressive in my area. It’s probably not the case but how can I find other progressives where I am, outside the church. 

I agree wholeheartedly with Philip that,

“In PCN we have to be more passionate about people than points of theology, we need to see ourselves as doers rather than doubters, and we must express our liberalism through the way we love and live.  It is then that we become true followers of Jesus and can justifiably begin the Eight Points with - ‘We are Christians.’”

Joe asks how, as someone outside the church, he can make contact with other progressives.  PCN Britain acts as an umbrella for about 55 groups around the UK where people meet outside the context of church worship, to think about Christianity from a progressive viewpoint.  These groups are listed on our website here http://www.pcnbritain.org.uk/index.php/locations/. 

Like many PCN Britain members, I found Philip Sudworth’s 2008 article inspiring.  I suspect there are many like Philip who, in wanting to focus on doing rather than doctrine, find common cause with folk of different theological persuasions and none.  But it sometimes helps to know why you are doing what you do.  Sharing time with questioning, progressive Christians in Gloucestershire can remind me of that perspective.

Andy

Christianity and far more on practical issues.